Elizabeth Warren discusses Musk’s ‘conflicts of interest.’ : NPR

Sen. Elizabeth Warren, D-Mass., says Elon Musk should be required to comply with the same stringent conflict of interest rules that federal employees have to follow.

Musk, a close adviser to President-elect Donald Trump who poured millions into his campaign effort, has been tapped as the co-lead of the president-elect’s government efficiency effort.

The outside group, called the Department of Government Efficiency, is charged with advising the incoming administration on cutting government spending. Musk — the world’s richest man, according to the Bloomberg Billionaires Index — is the CEO of Tesla, SpaceX and the owner of the social media site X.

“He either needs to divest his ongoing interests or he needs to fence off every part of his advice to the president to stay out of areas where he has clear financial conflicts,” Warren told Morning Edition host Michel Martin, echoing concerns she laid out in a letter to Trump’s transition team earlier this week. Musk’s companies received significant federal funding and have regulatory issues before the government.

Warren spoke with NPR about what she sees as Musk’s conflicts of interest.

This interview has been lightly edited for length and clarity.

Michel Martin: The emails from your office to the Trump transition team detailed a number of potential conflicts of interests surrounding Musk’s business interests and his apparently close relationship with Trump. The letter is quite extensive, but can you just enumerate a couple of them so people know what you’re talking about?

Sen. Elizabeth Warren: Think of it this way… Elon Musk owns many companies, including Tesla, SpaceX, Neuralink and X. The federal government has many touchpoints with all of those companies, including lots of federal contracts worth billions of dollars and lots of ongoing investigations about whether or not those companies have followed the regulations and including whether or not Mr. Musk himself has followed the law. So, there he is in the middle of all of this interaction with the federal government and whispering in Donald Trump’s ear about pretty much everything. And the concern of the American people is, is he actually whispering things that are good for the American public or just things that are really good for Elon Musk?

Martin: From what you describe, I think what you seem to be saying is that Musk’s interests are so extensive that he cannot avoid conflicts of interest. Is that what you’re saying?

Warren: Well, the first thing I’m saying is this is the Trump transition team’s own ethics rule. And I’m saying the one thing that’s clear in that ethics rule is even the appearance of a conflict of interest is a no no. Mr. Musk cannot be giving advice about electric cars, for example, at the same time that he has a huge ownership stake in Tesla. He can’t be giving advice about federal contracts for SpaceX at the same time that he’s selling his services to the federal government to launch rockets into space. He can’t be giving advice about starving the law enforcement arms of these regulatory agencies at the same time that they are investigating Mr. Musk and Mr. Musk’s companies.

Martin: There is a long history of business executives advising presidents informally. I mean, business executives are often invited on presidential missions, for example. Are you suggesting that there is something of an order of magnitude different about Elon Musk’s relationship with the Trump team?

Warren: I don’t have to suggest it, he has been given an official title by the president-elect. This is not just the ordinary lobbying that lots of people show up, including CEOs, and say, do this thing to help my business. He has been tasked with the job of rethinking how all parts of government work, and the Trump administration itself has said the appearance of a conflict of interest is wrong because they recognize that it undercuts people’s confidence in how those decisions are being made. Are they being made on behalf of the American people at large, or are they being made on behalf of enriching one billionaire?

Martin: So the Trump transition team has responded to your letter in a manner of speaking. They’ve responded to several news outlets by offering the same statement. And that statement, I’m sure you’ve heard it by now. It’s issued under the name of Karoline Leavitt, who is a spokeswoman for that transition. And she referred to you, with what has been seen as a derogatory reference, saying that, “Pocahontas can play political games and send toothless letters, but the Trump-Vance transition will continue to be held to the highest ethical and legal standards possible — a standard unfamiliar to a career politician whose societal impact is 1/1024th of Elon Musk’s.” What do you say to that?

Warren: Look, they can call me whatever name they want. They’re just looking to distract from the underlying problem. And that is they issued one ethics rule saying no one who is working in the transition will have even the appearance of a conflict of interest. And here’s Elon Musk with both the appearance and actual conflicts of interest all over the place. And they just don’t want to stop and wrestle with that.

Martin: Well, the Trump transition team seems to be suggesting that they’re not going to respond at all. They called it a toothless letter. Is that the case? I mean, do you have any method of enforcing oversight in this matter, or is the main tool of oversight bringing this to public attention?

Warren: The main tool is to bring it to public attention and to call it out over and over on behalf of the American people. Look, the Trump administration took on the commitment not to have people who had an appearance of a conflict of interest or an actual conflict of interest. That means it is now on them to explain how best buddy Elon Musk is whispering in the ear of the president of the United States at the same time that his companies have extensive contracts with the federal government and he himself and those companies are under extensive investigation by different parts of the federal government.